Bill Johnson Addresses Some of the Controversies Concerning Bethel Church

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Bill Johnson recently addressed some of the points of criticism raised against Bethel Church. We believe it is helpful to talk about them here.

Charismanews.com, a Christian information website, titled the interview “Bill Johnson Answers Hard-Hitting Questions About Bethel Controversies.” The interview is rather lenient, and it seems to be more of an opportunity for Bill Johnson to talk about his new book, “Good is Good,” while clearing Bethel’s name. The interview is conducted by Dr. Michael Brown, who interviewed Benny Hinn concerning controversies. In this interview with Bill Johnson, Michael Brown plainly says that he is keeping the questions short so that Bill Johnson has time to present his book.

In the interview, Michael Brown addresses three topics:

  • Sin and repentance,  which are not dealt with in Bethel Church’s teachings
  • Daughter-in-law Jenn Johnson’s description of the Holy Spirit. Jean Johnson is a pastor at Bethel Church and Bill Johnson’s daughter-in-law. She presents the Holy Spirit in the following manner: “I view the Holy Spirit like the Genie from Aladdin. And he’s blue. And he’s funny, and he’s sneaky.”
  • Grave sucking, which is the practice of soaking up deceased people’s anointing on their grave

Of course, Bethel Church is reproached for many more things, but let’s hear what Bill Johnson has to say on these three topics.

Sin and repentance

Michael Brown calls out Bill Johnson concerning a video in which Eric Johnson, pastor at Bethel and one of Bill Johnson’s son, declares that man is born good — this is clearly heresy.

What about sin, then? In the interview, Bill Johnson answers that sin exists and that repentance is necessary. What his son meant, he says, is that everyone is to be honored since they were created in the image of God.

We can only appreciate the fact that Bill Johnson recognizes that man is sinful and needs repentance. That is good to hear.

In the sermon that led to the controversy, Eric Johnson said this:

“Every government, every structure, every system fundamentally and theologically must start with the concept and the idea that people are good and they mean to do good. Even if they are not saved. We have to start with that premise.”

In the same sermon, he says:

“We have to adjust our perspective of people. We have to realize people are good and they mean to do good.”

Two months later, he talked about it again, visibly due to the criticism received in the wake of the previous sermon. In that sermon he explains that non-believers, atheists even, can do good, even more good that some Christians. He also says that even though one might do all the good they can, they cannot attain righteousness without Jesus. But by confessing Jesus, one obtains righteousness through faith.

However, he makes no mention of repentance.

But if Bill Johnson himself acknowledges man’s need to repent, what then is repentance for him?

Here is what he says about it in his book “The Supernatural Power of a Transformed Mind:”

“Renewing the mind begins with repentance. That is the gateway to retur to our original assignment on earth. Jesus said, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand”. To many Christians, repentance refers to having an altar call where people come forward and weep at the altar and get right with God. That is a legitimate expression of repentance, but it’s not what the word repentance means.. “Re” means to go back. “Pent” is like the penthouse, the top floor of a building. Repent, then, means to go back to God’s perspective on reality. And in that perspective there is a renewal, a reformation that affects our intellect, our emotions, and every part of our lives.”

In his book “When Heaven Invades Earth” is found a similar statement:

“The focus of repentance is to change our way of thinking until the presence of His Kingdom fills our consciousness.”

So when Bill Johnson recognizes that man needs to repent, he refers to that.

Thus, his definition leans more toward “seeing with God’s perspective” and/or “changing our thinking so that our conscience is filled with the presence of His Kingdom,” rather than turning from sin and to God.

For they themselves report about us what kind of a reception we had with you, and how you turned to God from idols to serve a living and true God, and to wait for His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead, that is Jesus, who rescues us from the wrath to come. 1 Thessalonians 1:9-10

We need to realize that we are on the wrong track, in sin, and to get on the right path.

Repentance is vital:

I tell you, no, but unless  you repent, you will all likewise perish. Luke 13:3

The Holy Spirit alone can convict of sin:

And He, when He comes, will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment; concerning sin, because they do not believe in Me; and concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father and you no longer see Me; and concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world has been judged.

John 16:8-11

The Lord Jesus tells us:

No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him.  John 6:44

But then we need to accept that we are sinners, to ask God for forgiveness, and change our behavior; not “fill our consciousness with the Kingdom of God.” The apostle Paul wrote:

but kept declaring both to those of Damascus first, and also at Jerusalem and then throughout all the region of Judea, and even to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds appropriate to repentance. Acts 26:20

Here’s a very good article on repentance according to Bill Johnson.

Jenn Johnson’s description of the Holy Spirit

In this video and in that one available on YouTube, Jenn Johnson describes the Holy Spirit. She presents him as such:

“The Holy Spirit to me is like the genie from Aladdin, and he’s blue, and he’s funny – and he’s sneaky […] “

Notice how she uses the adjective “sneaky,” which comes from “snake.” This is particularly shocking. Jenn Johnson made that description multiple times (at least twice in the first video, and yet another time in the second video).

We encourage you to watch the first video (1 min 26 sec). Her attitude is particularly telling.

What does Bill Johnson have to say about it?

He explains that he wouldn’t use these terms himself, and that these statements were made a long time ago. He adds that he talked about it with her and that they solved the issue. Good!

It is sad and puzzling that those videos are still on YouTube. The second clip was posted by Bethel itself, thus they can delete it whenever they want and should do it.

Grave Sucking / Mantle Grabbing

In response to accusations, Kris Vallotton had already posted a text on the topic on Facebook. The text is contradictory, as Kris Vallotton first says that he had never heard about grave sucking until a few months prior. But further down the article, he writes that it was a running joke at Bethel. As for the rest, the position that he adopts in the article is correct in that he rebukes the idea that one could receive the anointing of a deceased person by laying on their grave.

Granted this is just a joke, it doesn’t change the fact that by not communicating about it clearly, the practice misleads many. It is a bad joke, to say the least.

In the interview by Michael Brown, Bill Johnson confirms that Bethel Church does not teach people to seek anointing on deceased people’s graves, which is good to hear.

However, he does say that God told him to honor those that he considers great men of the faith, and that if we honor them, then God can release the same anointing again. He said this in the past already, and it is the reason why he is building a library museum with artifacts from past revivals, such as items that belong to Kathryn Kuhlman. God told him that he would then receive their anointing. Bill Johnson is thus expecting to receive the anointing of the people that will be honored in his museum. Thus there is no laying on graves, but we can’t help seeing the similarities.

Bill Johnson also wrote this is his book “Physics of Heaven” :

“There are anointings, mantles, revelations and mysteries that have lain unclaimed, literally where they were left, because the generation that walked in them never passed them on. I believe it’s possible for us to recover realms of anointing, realms of insight, realms of God that have been untended for decades simply by choosing to reclaim them and perpetuate them for future generations.” (Davis, 2012) Physics of Heaven – Bill Johnson

Hence, Bill Johnson teaches that anointings are unique and can be passed on. It is possible to get a hold of them where they have been left (and thus, where would that be, other than where the person who had that anointing died?)

What should we think of this statement by Cal Pierce (previously involved in Bethel and founder of the Healing Rooms)

“It was July 22, 1999 when we re-dug the wells of healing and opened up Healing Rooms in Spokane, Washington. The healing wells of John G. Lake had been waiting to be re-dug since 1935 when he passed away. I knew for this work to be available to the whole body of Christ, the focus must come off of a man, John G. Lake, and onto the Holy Spirit.”

Further down, Cal Pierce writes:

“Where the Holy Spirit is, His anointing is available to every believer.”

It is thus to be understood that the anointing is available at a specific location. Cal Pierce explains that he went and prayed on John G. Lake’s grave every month for a year until the Lord told him that he was to open a healing room at the very place where John G. Lake had his ministry. Ironically, Pierce ran a healing room in what he believed was Lake’s home, and several years later found out that Lake’s house had been torn down and rebuilt a long time prior. Thus it was the same location, but not the same house.

Once again we read about the concept of anointings that are bound to a specific person and can be passed on. Anointings seem to rest where the person was, and it is necessary to start from there before taking it further.

What the Bible says about anointing

It is a vast topic. Nevertheless, a distinction exists between what is said about it in the Old Testament and in the New Testament.

Anointing consists in pouring oil on a person or an item. In some cases, that anointing was accompanied with divine power.

In the Old Testament, anointing was reserved for high priests, kings, and some prophets, as well as leprous people.

Biblical references: Exodus 30:25-33; 1 Samuel 10:1; and 1 King 1:39; 1 King 19:16; Leviticus 14:17.

When a king died, his successor would be anointed by a high priest or a prophet. In the case of David, however, he was anointed while Saul was still alive.

Some artefacts were also consecrated in the same manner. This is no longer to be done under the New Covenant, yet some still do it.

In the New Testament, following Pentecost, the anointing of the Holy Spirit was made available to all born-again believers.

“But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you all know.”  1 John 2:20

“As for you, the anointing which you received from Him abides in you, and you have no need for anyone to teach you; but as His anointing teaches you about all things, and is true and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you abide in Him.”   1 John 2:27

Then, there are gifts of the Holy Spirit, which are different for each believer:

“Since we have gifts that differ according to the grace given to us, each of us is to exercise them accordingly: if prophecy, according to the proportion of his faith; if service, in his serving; or he who teaches, in his teaching; or he who exhorts, in his exhortation; he who gives, with liberality; he who leads, with diligence; he who shows mercy, with cheerfulness.”  Romans 12:6-8

“Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit. And there are varieties of ministries, and the same Lord. There are varieties of effects, but the same God who works all things in all persons. But to each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good. For to one is given the word of wisdom through the Spirit, and to another the word of knowledge according to the same Spirit; to another faith by the same Spirit, and to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit, and to another the effecting of miracles, and to another prophecy, and to another the distinguishing of spirits, to another various kinds of tongues, and to another the interpretation of tongues. But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills.” 1 Corinthians 12:4-11

Is grave sucking something that is really practice, or is it just a joke?

Grave sucking is in fact not a joke.

For example, Benny Hinn (who topped the list of the “friends of Bethel” on Bethel’s old website) stated that he regularly visited Kathryn Kuhlman’s grave and that he feels a special anointing when there.

John Crowder, a friend of the Johnson family, openly teaches this practice. He welcomes many Bethel students in his courses. See this video of John Crowder .

Moreover, several charistmatic magazines condemned the practice:

Other resources :

These practices are happening.

Does Bethel teach that practice?

A diversity of examples of Bethel teachings indicate that they consider that:

  • There exist special anointings;
  • Those anointings can be passed on from one person to another, as well as  (or exclusively?) after death;
  • One can “pick up” those anointings where they have been left;
  • One can “pick up” those anointings by honoring those who carried them before (could that potentially be idolatry?). This tends to remind us of veneration of saints.

From there, seeking to receive anointings on graves is not that great a stretch.

Bill Johnson may not do it, but his wife, leaders from his church, and students seem ready to engage with it.

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26 October 2016 admin News 39 Comments

39 Comments

  1. Anonymous

    January 20, 2018

    You are sad. You need to get filled with the Holy Spirit so you can have true discernment.

    • admin author

      January 20, 2018

      Hi Anonymous,
      Your comment doesn’t help. Let us know what’s wrong here and why.

      • Anonymous

        February 4, 2018

        What’s wrong with this article is that there is zero affirmation of anything. The article leans in with condemnation and criticism. There are aspects of Bill’s Johnson’s response that can be affirmed and this article is not an honest evaluation. Repent does mean to have God’s perspective on reality and that perspective is what causes us to turn from sin, confess, etc. You can’t repent without Truth. God’s perspective is the true perspective. I will not waste my time finding other things to affirm (Elijah and Elisha…MANTEL?? HMMM..Moses and Joshua…Mantel…Hmmm) because this author’s of this article had an agenda when it was written. Blah Blah Blah….I am so happy the author have squared the corners on Christianity and have the correct/only interpretation of Scripture, and defines who is in and who is out. Very arrogant, no humility, and not in the spirit of the God I serve. I have no issue with FAIR HUMBLE ASSESSMENTS….this is far from it.

        • Gene Anderson

          August 5, 2018

          I have been a believer for 53 years, read and studied the entire bible word for word for decades, and even wrote a verse by verse commentary. I say that for one reason. I have had multiple people come to me to tell me how bad Bethel is. I can only say that I started wacthing Bill Johnson’s surmans on youtube. I have yet to hear him say anything that is foundationally wrong. No one is perfect, but I will say that is the messages I have heard, have challened me and been on the money. My background is growing for years in a Calvary Chapel and later onto Assemblies of God.

  2. admin author

    February 5, 2018

    Hi Anonymous,

    Please read the article again. You mention that “There are aspects of Bill’s Johnson’s response that can be affirmed and this article is not an honest evaluation”.

    We wrote this, for instance : “We can only appreciate the fact that Bill Johnson recognizes that man is sinful and needs repentance. That is good to hear.”

    Regarding the mantels, there is a difference between the Old and New Testament. The Holy Spirit is now for every christian. You don’t find anthing close to a mantel in the NT.

    Several verses are about how the Holy Spirit gives according to His choice. There is no “transfer” from one to the other.

    1 Corinth. 12 is a good basis. There is no “special anointing” or “special anointed”. All christians are anointed, part of the body and the head of the body is Jesus. The message is clear, no part is more important than another.

    With respect, allow me to find your message not very loving.

    Please do some reseach on internet. You will find that this article shares the view of a lot of christians.

    • Anonymous

      June 4, 2018

      You got butthurt. That’s all

    • R. Alan

      June 13, 2018

      You don’t find anthing close to a mantel in the NT…

      Actually you do. John the Baptist came in the power & spirit of Elijah (a positive example); a negative example could be Jezebel showing up in the church(es) in the Book of revelation.

      BTW, I cannot subscribe to ‘grave sucking’

  3. Anonymous

    February 6, 2018

    Yes you do affirm (in passing). My apologies for not being loving. I ask your forgiveness. I simply prefer Jesus’ heart over other Christian views. As helpful articles are posted here they should be fair. If the article is about the interview…keep it about the interview. This article used the interview as a springboard to other comments and material making the interview seem untrustworthy and that the interview itself should not receive its own assessment. If you wanted to talk about Bill Johnson in general just do that. Don’t make him seem insincere in the interview with his comments.

  4. admin author

    February 6, 2018

    Hi Anonymous,

    Apologies accepted and if I hurt you, I also apologize.

    If you feel I make Bill Johnson insincere, you are right. It is what I want to demonstrate. Comparing what he says and the known facts, shows a difference.

    Just to take one, grave sucking. You find in the article several points that are not in line with the denial.

    Ben Fitzgerald was a Bethel leader (and still very close to Bethel), when he explained why they try to get the anointing of dead people. On the video (link in the article), he is with Bethel students.

    We find the same kind of “double talk” with the recent “Christ Alignement” debate. For instance this article : http://www.piratechristian.com/museum-of-idolatry/2017/12/kris-vallotton-runs-from-his-own-facebook-post.
    Kris Vallotton says in his first post : “Christians are now using “Christian Tarots Cards” (apparently called “Destiny Cards”) ” and so on.
    How can he be not aware that these Destiny Cards are used at Bethel, according to Theresa Dedmond (pastoral staff at Bethel) in a book prefaced by Bill Johnson.

    I also have just added a new post (was already available in french, I hope the translation is not too bad) : https://bewatchful.org/2015/11/28/deception-of-bill-johnson/

  5. Anonymous

    February 9, 2018

    I think its healthy to have a hard look at the facts and it is line with what the bible teaches us, that even the elect would be deceived if it were possible. It’s sad that someone said what is wrong is that there is zero affirmation. Jesus wasn’t always affirming. To those who were misrepresenting the kingdom of God (the pharisees) he rebuked them and it was to sinners who did not know the truth he appeared with love. I have always been struck by that, and that it is not often preached now. There is this Jesus being preached who is only loving and never angry at injustice and at hypocrisy and at people misrepresenting the kingdom of God, but Jesus in the bible did all those things. Its a half gospel being preached. Thanks for writing this article. I just had my own reaction to realising you have to pay to watch bethel tv and that there is a price to pay to hear the gospel. It is in the new testament that ananias and sapphira were stuck down. This always affirming God being preached takes away a healthy fear of God, which the bible says is the beginning of wisdom. Looking for the truth in a situation does not make you lack affirmation, it makes you want to be in truth and that is a principle that is line with who Jesus is. We are warned to look for false prophets and that we would know them by their fruit. Also the comment saying you need the Holy Spirit to know true discernment is true and it sounds like you do. To start that comment with an insult begs to question if the author was writing in the spirit or the flesh though. I thought it was an interesting article and was very measured. Thanks.

  6. Carl

    March 6, 2018

    Dear author,
    I just want to say thank you for your peaceful and humble tone in the comments section. I found it graceful and inspiring.

  7. Adam Beck

    March 23, 2018

    I stumbled upon this site in my ongoing quest for facts. I appreciate many of the facts stated here. However the overwhelmingly biased tone in which these facts are shared, along with a nonchalant and routine vacillation between fact and opinion; which forces the reader to make the tedious and vague distinction between the two, diminishes the credibility of the author, in my opinion. It’s unfortunate because there is missed potential here; and because the one who resorts to inflammatory accusations, often sacrifices the credibility born naturally of kindness by so doing. As is the case here, I believe.

    There are many people I disagree with theologically, some I feel even lead people astray. And I do agree with much (not all) of what I read on this site.

    Yet to dedicate a “ministry” to attacking these people is poor form, unattractive, unproductive, and dangerous ground. We have been given the ministry of reconciliation, according to Scripture. Let God be the Judge then of another’s servants. Let us therefore preach Christ and Him crucified; not proclaim others crucified for Christ’s sake.

    – Adam Beck
    Nashville, TN

    (I do not check the email I provided and consequently will not be made aware of any further replies on this thread. And I’ll not visit this site again to either read or reply to any further comments.)

  8. admin author

    March 23, 2018

    Adam,

    Thanks for your message, but it would help if you would provide some examples.

    If facts are missing, let us know which ones you would like to see.

    Quotes are clearly highlighted.

    We have to let God judges the heart, but He asks us to examine teachings. There are multiple warnings in the NT regarding false prophets, teachers and so on.

    You seem to agree that some people leads other astray. The purpose of this site is to encourage people to read the Bible and stay on a solid ground.

    Don’t worry, we don’t use e-mail addresses, they are not even mandatory.

  9. Anonymous

    April 19, 2018

    Wow, I’m taken note of this site to not drift to it again

  10. Ann

    April 19, 2018

    we are to exspose deeds of darkness. call them out. Church read your Bible. Be not deceive . Many in the church are a sleep. Wake up church. We are living in the last days. The sings of the times are everywhere. The Bible says except there come a falling away than the end will come. Thank you for standing on the truth. Judgement must begin at the house of God. We are not to have fellowship with darkness. Read your Bible. Watch and Pray Jesus said.

  11. Mark Kennicott

    April 23, 2018

    Thank you for this article. Frankly, I think you were more generous with Johnson than his comments deserve. As a Pentecostal pastor, I am alarmed at the amount of nonsense that passes for Christian thinking these days. We need a revival of the Word of God in our midst, and a fear of God that causes us to once more tremble at His Word (Isa. 66:2). We need people who will fall in love with Jesus, and seek His face more than we seek His blessings. He is the prize!

  12. Matthew

    April 23, 2018

    Thank you for this article. It is well presented and thoughtfully written. Your responses to the various comments are also encouraging. Thank you again.

  13. Brik

    April 24, 2018

    This was an excellent, factual article that many need to read to be warned of the serious dangers and deceptions among charismatic Christians. Deceiving spirits and practices going on in Charismatic circles are counterfeit signs and wonders from grave sucking to holy laughter, holy barking, glitter falling from heaven, the angel Emma. The bible even warns that in the last days the elect might almost be deceived. This is connected to the same people who are part of the New Apostolic Reformation and the 7 mountains of C Peter Wagner in thinking they can create the kingdom of heaven on earth and take over the land, almost makes me think it will be connected to the antichrist and false prophets to come. Its basically sorcery and witchcraft, and not the spirit of God. The bible in nowhere indicates the world will become paradise on earth until after the tribulation when Jesus physically comes down to earth and rules with an iron rod. It also tells us that many will come in the last days who will be false prophets and teach falsehoods with signs and wonders. Interesting how some who are being deceived by this get very angry, vindictive, and hateful. I’ve personally known people who have reacted the same way. This is not the spirit of God leading them. Some demonic spirit gets really upset when people are told the truth. If it was God’s spirit they would react with self control, love, kindness and humility as the author of this article demonstrated in responding to the commenters.

  14. Jon Michael Loyy

    April 24, 2018

    Bill Johnson, is in my opinion one of the best teachers presently in the Kingdom of God. Yet, it is said that he doesn’t want to police people….which only perpetuates the false notion that the police somehow by enforcing standards (law) is not a good thing. I’ll admit that “enforce” is a tad bit strong. Keeping the flies out of the anointing oil…is our responsibilty. ”

    Because Bill is a loving, caring man of God, he doesn’t go around slapping people, tellng them to get it right wife and daughter in law….flipping whackjobs! They are a huge emnarrassment to the Kingdom of God. Ifee. sorry for Bill and his son. The “wakey wakey” expression for wakng up the angels is utterly ignorant and very stupid. No intelligence there.

  15. Eng Ong

    May 3, 2018

    Thank you for your article and careful research on Bethel. Gracious and balanced approach to the controversies at hands. The real problem with Bill Johnson and Bethel is not so much in their behaviours as bad as they are, but in their belief system. Things like grave sucking, mocking the Holy Spirt as a genie or redefining repentance as having one’s mind to have a perspective of God etc is the result of their irreverence to the absolute authority of the Word of God.

    They always can try to explain or explain away their actions after the fact where damage has already been done to their congregation and students. Imagine the kind of spirits the misguided students would attract to themselves by hugging to graves. And the dishonouring way their people would learn from Bill’s daughter regarding the Holy Spirit by calling the Almighty God a genie and sneaky. These and other more serious errors will occur repeatedly with more dangerous consequences if Bill and his leadership refuse to repent from their errors.

    Yes, Bethel Church does practise spiritual activities that are Unscriptural. But more seriously the problem lies in their lack of the fear of the Lord and lack of clear repentance from their errors. For example, calling the Holy Spirt sneaky is not a matter of ‘Ops sorry, we will never do it again. Trust me.’ It is a mockery spirit that is operating in their house and this spirit needs to be dealt with. For someone who claims to receive regular revelation from God, Bill does not seem to be able to discern demonic spirits operating right under his own roof. This is a very dangerous form of deception.

    As a pentecostal pastor myself who had seen seven years of revival in the Far East where the Spirit of God moved in great power, I find Bethel is dabbling on very dangerous ground spiritually.

    Thank you once again for your work.

  16. Mike B.

    May 4, 2018

    All very interesting. I have read a few of Bill Johnson’s works and have never found any of the flakiness that is being discussed here. I find the daughter-in-law’s comments about the Holy Spirit to be immature, perhaps, but it seemed to be more an expression of how she FEELS about her relationship with Him, NOT an expression that anyone should view the Spirit as a genie in a bottle to be commanded, an idea that is clearly incorrect and heretical.

    As for passing on a spiritual mantel, I have heard a bit of teaching about this, and as someone noted above, there is precedence with Elijah and Elisha, Moses and Joshua, and others. However, the idea that this “practice” is superseded in the New Testament by anointing all believers should be considered, too, and I wonder if there might be a balance somewhere. God Himself is the same, yesterday, today, and tomorrow, but His Covenant . . . ? Well, that has changed, has it not?

    As for the rest about grave-sucking–the term itself is repulsive to me. I would prefer to call upon the Lord to give me a “like anointing” if at all.

    Folks, I have seen fruit from this ministry of Bill Johnson. I had heard nothing of these controversies until a day or two ago, and I live 3000 miles from Be them, so I do not attend. In any case, as another brother says above, we should seek reconciliation. Pray for them that God will direct them. Pray also that God will show you likewise where your own doctrine is off. None of us does everything correctly. Is our heart deeply loving and seeking God? Then, Lord, in Your mercy, guide us into all truth!

  17. Tom K

    June 6, 2018

    Yes, there is incredible fruit from Bethel’s loving ministry in individuals, in the secular Redding community, around the world. I do believe repentance is a change of mind. As we are “transformed by the renewing of our mind” we gain the “mind of Christ”, and a change in our behavior follows. Repentance is not confession or a decision to stop a sinful behavior. It is making Jesus Lord rather than ourselves and behavioral change results by the power of the Spirit not our will power. And I think Jenn’s personal picture of the Holy Spirit is simply cute and harmless. Regardless of your theological offense, I doubt it’s offensive to Him whom is definitely playful and whom she adores.

    • admin author

      June 6, 2018

      Hi,
      It depends what we call fruits.
      For instance regarding the secular Redding community, have a look at this for instance : https://www.marketwatch.com/story/10-most-miserable-cities-in-america-2014-05-07

      Redding ranks 3rd…, even if Bethel has been established there for decades.

      Look at the crime rate, the health level, and other indicators. Redding is far from Paradise.

      We can’t rely on their claims, not even from the city Council. One of the member is an elder of Bethel Church and they give large amount of money to the city (last year US$ 500’000 for the police dpt).

      • Anonymous

        June 6, 2018

        Strange answer. You, sir, are an odd fellow, pharisee.

        • admin

          June 7, 2018

          According to the Bible, pharisee were accused of :

          – twisting the scripture
          – putting burden on other (which were not even biblical)
          – hypocrisy

          They were requesting more from the other than what they would do themselves.

          Those who compared teaching vs scripture were called “noble Bereans”. (Acts 17:11).

          If examining facts instead of believing every claim makes you a pharisee, then I am one. But that’s not what the Bible says.

          I encourage you to examine more in depth the claims of Bethel and such (including gold dust/angel’s feather and so on).

          And of course examining their teaching vs the Bible is important.

          • Anonymous

            June 8, 2018

            The Pharisees operated in a religious spirit, letter of the law, puffed up, not recognizing a move of God’s Spirit. I would caution you to bewatchful of that in yourself in your self appointed guardianship of biblical truth.

  18. admin

    June 9, 2018

    Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. 1 John 4:1

    We have to examine if the “move” is from God’s Spirit or not. This based on the Scriptures and facts.

    • Anonymous

      June 22, 2018
    • Shane

      July 20, 2018

      There is one glaring problem with every person who criticizes this ministry. There is no love in their judgements. The Bible tells us in 1 Corinthians 13: “1 If I speak in the tongues[a] of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3 If I give all I possess to the poor and give over my body to hardship that I may boast,[b] but do not have love, I gain nothing.”

      I have literally gained nothing from the dissension caused by these “attacks”. I call them attacks because that is precisely what they are. “The enemy comes to steal, kill and destroy, but I come that you may have life.” There is life being produced by the ministries at Bethel Church. So I ask, has life EVER been produced by this nay-saying? I will not answer that question, I only ask it so that the people reading this can begin thinking for themselves rather than having a critical and negative person who does not LOVE do the thinking for them. I make this suggestion to anyone who would like to raise more questions concerning any ministries actions/teachings. Read 1 Corinthians 13 in full, and ask the Lord to help you to discern the areas in YOUR life where you are not speaking or acting in love.

      As for the writers of articles such as this one, I pray that you are not judged by the same standard with which you are judging. In the words of JESUS: “By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.” John 13:35.

      This ministry has recorded 10’s of thousands of hours of service content so that the name of Jesus and his fame can be spread across the earth. I would dare a guess, that not all the nay-sayers combined have as much experience in public speaking nor do they have such a large public eye upon them. If they had, they would understand that even the messenger is human. But thats the beauty of God, He takes broken people and uses them for His glory! (ie. David, Saul/Paul, Peter, Rahab, Jacob, Abraham, Moses and just about every other Bible hero you could name)

      “3And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst, 4They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act. 5Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou? 6This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not. 7So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her. 8And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground. 9And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst. 10When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee? 11She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.” John 8:3-11

      God bless you in your search for truth.
      p.s. Jesus is the way, the TRUTH and the life

      Shane

      • BRIEN

        July 20, 2018

        The thing is, there is a great love for others to warn them about something that is potentially as dangerous and destructive as apostasy and false, deceptive doctrines and practices, its literally helping to save people from going down that path. When the bible says that in the last days there will be many deceiving spirits, fasle signs and wonders done in Jesus name, and that the elect might almost be deceived, as well as the fact that many lukewarm believers are being taken in by false deceptive doctrines, there is nothing unloving about trying to save people from that. I tried to warn a couple of different friends about this, by relating to them the unbiblical things going on at Bill Johnson’s church, and they all wrote me off and wouldn’t have anything to do with me after that. So whose the unloving one here. They could not deal with honest, respectful discussion of the facts? I’m open to learning in humility to see if I’m wrong or not, but these people shut down the discussion immediately when it was something they didn’t want to hear. The apostasy and falling away of believers is serious stuff and very sad to me, my heart goes out to those people that are being taken in by any false signs and wonders or deceptive, demonic practices. We are told to hate sin but love the sinner, and if our brother or sister stumbles onto the path of sin, we are to try to warn them and help them get back on the right path. In the same way, following after false doctrines or participating in things like grave sucking are sins if they don’t line up with the word of God, hence we are to try to warn and save our brothers and sisters from going down that path. Does that make sense? Does that make people unloving? Especially in light of the very obvious proof of what things are not lining up with the word of God. Jesus said to seek first the kingdom of God and its righteousness. To love the Lord our God with all of our heart mind and strength, and if you love me you will obey my commandments. The Word of God gives us the Lord’s various commandments, so if we no longer heed them or attempt to learn what they are then we are not loving God. It was disturbing to hear that at Bethel they no longer talk about sin but just want to affirm everyone as they are and give praise to people. There needs to be a balance of holding people accountable and helping them to examine their life and see where they need to get right with God, while giving encouragement and affirmation, but to only give praise and affirmation, something is wrong.

        • Anonymous

          July 20, 2018

          I only have a moment for a short response, so I will be brief. It sounds to me as though you are taking a bunch of little snippets and creating a doctrine out of it. This is exactly what has been done with the Bible for the last 30 years. You can make the Bible say whatever you want if you are willing to remove context and audience from it. I challenge you to listen to the full interview again, but this time don’t listen for statements to attack. Listen to the heart of the man making the statements. I think you may come to understand more fully the motive behind the thoughts.

          God Bless,
          Shane

  19. Anonymous

    June 22, 2018

    Each of us, as followers of Christ, have to discern what is right and scriptural. Although I do believe in maybe receiving the anointing of others, but people that are alive, not dead people. The Word says to not have anything to do with the dead. To me that is getting strangely close to talking to the dead. I don’t feel comfortable with it, and so I won’t be doing it, or encouraging it, I don’t see it clear in scripture; and I love Bethel music, I do believe it is anointed, but this is not something I would condone unless I were to get some revelation from the Holy Spirit that would give me peace about it.

  20. larry stutes

    July 18, 2018

    If people would spend half of the time seeking Gods Holy Spirit for answers and emulating his characteristics rather than trying to judge, criticize and other wise speak on things they have no clue about, they would be much more acceptable to god and holy and anointed and doing what you were sent here for in the first place. Most of them just end up a tool of the devil and never realize it. Realize this, God is much greater than the bible and operates in it, over it and above it. He is sovereign, more loving, more generous, and more merciful and gracious, less tolerant of sin than you will ever know and not hindered by your ignorance, arrogance and level of life that needs serious help in most cases. What we see most of the times are kiddies trying to eat meat and choking to death on it and blaming everyone else for their ignorant ideas and their God who they have managed to put a box with a label on it that makes a mockery of us all. These types of people have heaps to learn about God and have earned the name Pharisee.

  21. TH

    July 25, 2018

    If God has already given us the Holy Spirit to live within us , why do we need to go to somebody grave to get a Anoiting? If they really want to grave suck, why don’t they go to Jesus grave? Why go to others? Doesn’t make sense to me at all

  22. Rodney Pidd

    August 5, 2018

    Firstly, I am delighted to see a website where it appears that the desire is the pursuit of the truth and the exposure of false teachers and false doctrines. This heart, if rightly directed, can only be for the good of the church.

    Regarding repentance:

    2 Timothy 2:19-21 New King James Version (NKJV)
    19 Nevertheless the solid foundation of God stands, having this seal: “The Lord knows those who are His,” and, “Let everyone who names the name of Christ depart from iniquity.”

    20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and silver, but also of wood and clay, some for honor and some for dishonor. 21 Therefore if anyone cleanses himself from the latter, he will be a vessel for honor, sanctified and useful for the Master, prepared for every good work.

    Therefore, not everyone in “a great house” is a vessel for honor, but only those who repent.

    Romans 8:13 New King James Version (NKJV)
    13 For if you live according to the flesh you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live.

    Repentance is only by the power of the Holy Spirit. We can not do it by ourselves. If you do not understand this then I suggest that you would ask the Holy Spirit what He means.

    Matthew 7:21-23 New King James Version (NKJV)
    I Never Knew You
    21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

    Many people who confess Jesus Christ as their Lord and have even walked in His power will be cast into hell because they did not repent, but continued to practice lawlessness. Their will be many Jesus said. Many false pastors, many false teachers, many false evangelists, many false apostles and many false prophets. Many people who call themselves christians but are wise in their own opinions, rather than wise in-Christ will find themselves cast aside for eternity.

    2 Thessalonians 2 New King James Version (NKJV)
    The Great Apostasy
    2 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

    5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

    Stand Fast
    13 But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth, 14 to which He called you by our gospel, for the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. 15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold the traditions which you were taught, whether by word or our epistle.

    16 Now may our Lord Jesus Christ Himself, and our God and Father, who has loved us and given us everlasting consolation and good hope by grace, 17 comfort your hearts and establish you in every good word and work.

  23. John W Reed

    August 17, 2018

    religious tradition led folk get stuck on their traditions. Read the actual Scripture on New Covenant repentance. The word literally means to change your mind. That’s the word, metanoia. Read it in your strongs concordance. That’s the Greek word used all through the New Covenant. When you repent you change your mind about what your thinking, what your doing, or speaking that is what brings the change. His Grace flowing towards you causes the change of mind. I think your focusing on something that is not doctrine or something taught. Jenn just gave her personal understanding of how the Spirit works in her life. She wasn’t creating a doctrine. If you want to speak about strange doctrines, look at Michael Brown and the other Judaizers. The wish the Church to embrace Mosaic Law and Jewish customs and manners. They want the Church to observe Sabbath and celebrate the feasts. Paul clearly teaches against this as going backwards and embracing the shadow and ignoring the substance Jesus.

  24. Rodney Pidd

    August 18, 2018

    In response to John W. Reed:

    Yes John repentance is about changing your mind, but true repentance leads to transformation.

    “There were present at that season some who told Him about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices. And Jesus answered and said to them, “Do you suppose that these Galileans were worse sinners than all other Galileans, because they suffered such things? I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish. Or those eighteen on whom the tower in Siloam fell and killed them, do you think that they were worse sinners than all other men who dwelt in Jerusalem? I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish.””
    ‭‭Luke‬ ‭13:1-5‬ ‭NKJV‬‬
    http://bible.com/114/luk.13.1-5.nkjv

    The repentance that Jesus Christ is referring to is to stop sinning. Yes change your mind about it and then stop doing it. So therefore Jesus is not just saying change your mind about sin, but he telling His listeners to stop sinning or perish.

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